Welcome to the class blog! The John Jay - Vera Fellows Program is a collaborative effort between John Jay College and the spin-off agencies of the Vera Institute of Justice, combining an internship and participation in a seminar taught by faculty from John Jay's Interdisciplinary Studies Program. (To see a video about the John Jay - Vera Fellows Program, click here.) Part of the seminar experience is weekly participation in the class blog, which keeps the conversation going from week to week and will be a place for you to share your thoughts and concerns about the materials discussed in seminar as well as the internship experience. The opinions expressed on this blog do not necessarily reflect the views of the Vera Institute of Justice or its spin-off organizations. While the blog is open to the public and anyone, theoretically, can comment, only class members and invited guests will be able to post. You can also look for us on our student and alumni page on Facebook.
Each student has been assigned one week to write the "post." Please post within 24 hours after class. Every week, each student must comment on the post (feel free to comment more than once). Please comment by Monday afternoon to allow time for further questions and responses and so that we can read all the entries before class.

Monday, October 20, 2008

Being a Lady vs. Being a Woman

So far we’ve talked a lot about the injustices of the system that comprises our conception of criminal justice, especially those faced by the “accused”. We’ve also spent some time talking about some of the struggles we will and have faced as criminal justice workers or even observers. But, I’d like to take this opportunity to talk about the unique challenges, we, as women face; especially as we attempt to become leaders in a male dominated world and field.


A few weeks ago the New York Times had an article about the growing number of female corrections officers in New York City prisons. One of the officers interviewed for the article describes her need to harden herself for her job. She makes a distinction between ladies and women. Ladies, she explains, “do not belong in jail”. This is an issue I often discuss with my sister, as she is in construction management. There’s an inherent contradiction between being a good woman and being a good professional. On one hand we’re expected to be soft, pretty and helpless, but to do our jobs we need to be tough, serious and capable. This contradiction seems to be especially palpable when women have the responsibility of leading or delegating to male subordinates. I regret to say that my sister and I have yet to come up with a solution. We usually leave the conversation feeling very uneasy. Not only do we have to overcome sexual harassment and overall inappropriateness, but then it seems we have to work harder than our male counterparts just to prove ourselves. I understand that many of these problems are larger societal issues. So realistically, we may simply have to employ coping mechanisms to tolerate them. I wonder what coping mechanisms are appropriate and when they are healthy as opposed to enablers of injustice.

But, the article also pointed out some the benefits of having more women corrections officers. Statistically, NYC jails seem to be getting safer and less violent. This means that whatever dynamic the shift in the gender of corrections officers brings has had some positive effects. Whatever unique abilities women bring to their jobs (stereotyped or not) they can improve things. We shouldn’t necessarily abandon all things ‘feminine’ for success, when success is measured by a masculine paradigm. Rather, we should assess our abilities on an individual level. Hopefully, we can cultivate our personal virtues and talents and apply progressive compassionate justice to all levels of our mission in a way that transcends gender.

12 comments:

Darakshan said...

I also read the New York Times article you are referring to. The same line you pointed out in your article is the same line that stuck in my head. "Ladies do not belong in jail." The statement is powerful becuase it equates being a lady with the weak characteristics of femininity. Realistically, that statement can be said for any male-dominated environment.
In the article, the main officer had stated that once an inmate had made a sexual comment about her body, she felt so disrespected that she practiced stiffening her walk to make sure her hips would not sway. This is an issue all women face, not only in the work-force but even walking on the street. Women are sexualized and men make verbal statements about it. When the same women become their co-workers or even their bosses,some men do not know how to change their attitudes/treatment of women. Women constantly feel that we must change something in ourselves. We wear baggier clothes, walk rigid, talk in a deeper voice and truly focus on de-feminizing ourselves to get rid of being sexualized. In addition, we also have to make sure that we prove ourselves to be if not as good as the guy but even better and yet we are still making seventy cents to his dollar.
You are absolutely correct, there are certain advantages of being a woman in male-dominated fields and that is in the role of a "mother." In the same article, the same female officer felt she had power over the men when they saw her as a mother. Realistically, women have to juggle a million roles and among that list is to learn when being a woman works for us and when it does not.

Professor Reitz said...

Thank you, Greta and Darakshan, for bringing up these really crucial issues. I teach a course on female detective fiction and have read a ton of stuff about this over the years and I thought the NYT article was fantastic. My sister, who is a Department Chair, and I talk about this all the time, too, and we, too, don't have any great ideas. But one thing we can do is to be good critical observers about how our institutions (big and small, work, school, family) are gendered. What have you noticed about where you are interning? Any differences between those institutions and where you work for money? School?

elizabeth.antola said...

Greta you bing up an issue that affects so many type of professions, and cultures outside the U.S. It is particulary true that in various criminal justice fields being an assertive woman is more well respected than a lady. What I seem to notice is that advocates in an agency working toward the progression of an ex offender will be more soft and accepting. While on the other hand a profession in the criminal justice field such as corrections they do not need these type of characteristics in their staff. Many times in fields such as corrections where they are directly dealing with offenders they do not want a sweet helpless woman. On the other hand in the agency that I'm working with there is an extreme difference of how woman would act in corrections oposed to this agency. When a criminal is incarcerated the staff is not expected to act as they are there for the prisoners needs. Its interesting to see how woman are expected to change with different situations.

Alisse Waterston said...

Thank you Greta for raising such an important issue and for stating it so eloquently (you are all so awesome!). And the challenge you ask us to consider is really so very difficult: how do we address the gender contradictions we face every day, what are some effective "coping mechanisms" to deal with that which we can't change, and in what ways can we bring our (gendered) experiences and insights to the table to make things better? It's interesting to note that our seminar group is all women. I wonder how that shapes the discussion we might have, and, if there were men in the group, I wonder how that might turn the discussion in other ways.

For me personally, part of the "gender problem" is acknowledging that it exists at all. The other issue I struggle with has to do with my own adoption of stereotypical gender roles--even if I contest these intellectually. How do we extricate ourselves from such entrenched, deeply embedded blueprints for proper behavior, activities, even interests? It's a hard one.

I'm so sorry I'm going to miss class discussion this week (am going to a conference) because I know it is going to be so rich!

Prof. Stein said...

I also read the article and was struck by the magnitude of the changes in criminal justice work, traditionally almost a parody of stereotypic gender roles played out along lines of submission (the offenders) and domination (the officers). At this stage, the article suggests that women may attempt to eradicate gender difference in order to "perform" dominant roles in ways that are similar to their male counterparts. After all, it is the only template we have!

We know that, on the streets, situations are less likely to get out of hand and end violently when the police pair includes a female officer. (In fact, that is why NYPD now requires all teams answering domestic violence calls-typically the calls on which officers are most likely to be injured-to include a female officer.)

In the world of corrections, a similar dynamic may be taking place. With so little empirical research being done on this transitional phase, when women take over these jobs and something in the dynamic tempers violent outcomes, it may be overlooked when, indeed, it should be hoisted up as a model for reinvention of the system. (Similar to the way that more women in corporate America triggered a sea change in the way companies started to deal with family leave, on-site day care, etc. for executives, a change which benefitted men as well as women: see "At work" columnist Lisa Belkin's final NY Times article, last week.)

When something works, and is profitable, it should be advertised. As women, we are too often afraid to self-promote and bring these successes to the attention of our bosses. I have an article to give you on Thursday that discusses this issue.

renee said...

Personally, I identify as "gender queer"- I recognize that I am female bodied, but I do not identify female (just queer).

My androgynous presentation means that sometimes I "pass" as male in society. Having the privilege of being able to live under two different gender's expectations and guideline's (sometimes simultaneously) I've certainly come to respect men more (male identified... male bodied... whatever being male means to who ever is defining it...) and I've also learned a few things.

I think the most important thing I've learned is that women and men (and everyone else: ladies, gents, trans and intersex folks too...) are ALL victims of the patriarchy. Men need to figure out what it means to "be a man" and be successful in a similar way women need to figure out what it means to "be a woman" and be successful. Men also need to make sure their hips don't sway the wrong way or they don't look 'soft' to fit in with society.

Though chances are, men have been perfecting their swag since preschool because of peer pressure where as women hit a brick wall much later when they're told by society that the walk they've used their whole life makes them appear weak.

The second most important thing I've learned is that the less feminine you appear to society, the more respect you get from it. Society including both men and women- can equally enforce patriarchal standards. (Actually, I am more likely to be disrespected by a woman for being "too butch of a woman" than I am by a man)

Greta, I like your "coping mechanism" vs. "enablers of injustice" balance. Right before typing this I was writing (lamenting) about a similar idea, though I certainly don't have any answers!

Kerry-Ann Hewitt said...
This comment has been removed by the author.
Kerry-Ann Hewitt said...

Such an excellent topic! A great example of this is the Hillary Clinton dilemma, “to cry or not to cry”, which we all saw during her presidential campaign. I believe Hillary Clinton is a formidable figure. Through her commitment to solving many tough social issues that affects society, she has earned the respect of both men and women. She has shown that she can stand shoulder to shoulder with any man, and she wears her pants well (lol).

Yet she was regarded by both men and WOMEN as lacking emotions, being too manly or not being womanly enough. Shamelessly these criticisms were not extended to any other candidate. The chatter regarding her character on the campaign trail got to a boiling point that when she became emotional in response to a question she was asked by a fellow woman, there were speculations that she simply faked those emotions to gain sympathy from voters. Others weighed in that she was indirectly forced to show emotions so she would not be seen as too tough of a woman.

A woman’s role today is truly complex. Women juggle simultaneously many roles and responsibilities ranging from caretaker, breadwinner, wife etc. I feel it is unfortunate that women feel they must down play their great abilities to satisfy the ego of men. I also feel we can win this gender bias fight if we support each other in being unapologetically “tough”, so far we are not unified.

MaureenG said...

This is such a necessary discussion! Since the first day of class I have noticed (how could I not) that we were all woman! How I wish we had a man in the class so that we could gain his insight in this discussion!

As has been stated, the only real way to tackle this problem is by coming together and spreading the word that this is, in fact, an issue. As Renee said, this issue is not confined to woman but men as well.

I would like to focus my post on woman offenders. As a general statistic, crime amongst woman has been on the rise. Is this because more woman are offending or more woman are being reported for their offenses? There is no way to truely know, but my opinion is that it is a little of both. While gender sterotypes obviously still exist, they are less binding in today's world and do not result in the same desparate outcomes when a woman steps out of her expected role.

Woman, in the past, were usually not repremanded for their offenses (whether legally or socially). Throughout history crimes committed by by woman have been taken less seriously. So what is different about today if more woman are offending and more are being prosecuted.

I think it is because we are on the right track. Woman are pushing themselves into professional positions and are finally standing up against the "overall inappropriatebess" received by men. However, I think we owe some credit to our female offenders. While I do no agree with violent crime, these woman are showing the world that they are not weak, helpless, victims of their circumstance and they do pose a real threat. Also, crimes by woman receive mcuh media attention because it is more interesting. This is seen most directly through woman who assault (or kill) their husbands who abused them. Even if they end up serving life sentences, the message is the same; we are not incapable of being aggressive, assertive, and violent. This is further reinforced by female students fighting in schools. I think the media exposure of woman offenders has done us some good.

There is no solution in female offending... just evidence against stereotypes. However, these offenders make a great point at proving woman can be both emotional (as you see many female offenders cry when asked about their crimes) and strong.

Prof. Stein said...

Just a note on female offenders. I think the majority of the statistical rise has come in drug arrests for women in neighborhoods where large numbers of the men are already incarcerated, and women take up their positions in the drug market, usually at the lowest levels.

octavia said...

It is interesting to discuss this subject at a seminar where all students and professors are women…
We chose to work in a field that years ago was male dominated field. In the past, women didn’t choose to be correction officers because this job did not suit their predominant housewife status. And, until recently we referred to police officers as police man. Most jobs were gender segregated. However things changed and women these days can have or aspire to any job. The Chancellor of Germany is a woman and America had a woman as a presidential candidate. But with all the efforts and improvements women made, there are still many situations in which women are looked down. We had to work hard to get where we are and we need to work even harder to keep our positions in place.

Law enforcement agencies were seen as inappropriate for women because those jobs employed so much violence. It was believed that women were too soft to handle a job of that kind, but maybe this is what the system really needed, a bit of softness. Women help humanize places like prisons. There are things that can be corrected without the use of force. I believe that we should not loose our charm and softness just to prove that we are suitable for a job. I think we should hold a position because we have the required knowledge and abilities not because we are insensitive and tough.

Amanda said...

It's funny that gender roles is the topic of the week; it has been something I have discussed on several occasions. Not with my sister, or friend, but with the 4 year old girl (Julia) I babysit. She's entered a phase where she won't wear anything that's not pink, purple, red, etc. She'll only wear skirts, only play with dolls. Sounds pretty typical- but she also is adament about pointing out anytime her 6 year old brother is doing anything she views as "for girls only." Yesterday the kids were over and they were playing with my two cats (one is a boy, Louie, the other is a girl, Mona). Julia did not like that Louie was playing with a pink mouse, and Mona was playing with a blue mouse. As she tries to sit the cats down, swtich their toys, and explain to them that "girls stick to pink, and boys stick to blue," I try talking to her- seize the moment and make it a life changing lesson, explain to her that Louie doesn't care if he's playing with a pink mouse, and Mona doesn't care if she's playing with a blue mouse, because all that matters is that they are happy. As I am attempting to get her to blur the lines of the gender barrier she believes should exist, I start remembering that when I bought those pink and blue toys I picked them out so that Mona would have a "girl" toy, and Louie would have a "boy toy." So what can I say.

My point is, I think it is important for us to question and challenge the gender barriers, to try and change people's opinions, but also realize amidst our efforts to do so, how we are perpetuating those "typical" gender characteristics.

As Maureen said, the number of women coming into the criminal justice system is on the rise. I know that the women clients in my program typically prefer to talk to the women staff members about their problems. At Project Renewal I conduct one-on-one interviews with the clients. The client and I do this in one of the apartments. I've noticed how each of the staff members treats me while I am doing the interviews. When I am around the male staff members, one of them always sits in on the interview, never leaving me alone. When I am around the women staff members, they open the apartment door for me and then leave the client and I alone in the apartment (with the door open).

I think it's interesting to think about those women who ended up in jail because they were trying to be "ladies"- (specifically, the caregiver) for example, those who might have had to get invovled in illegal activity so they would have money to take care of their children, afford rent, etc. I also think the role of the "lady" is lost when there is not a strong "man" role to compliment it. I am so glad that Renee said that everyone (males, females, etc) are victims of patriarchy. How very true.